Host (00:05)
just into the conversation. Very cool.

Casey (00:08)
Okay, from the beginning. We're not from the Okanagan originally. My husband and moved in 2015 from Ontario. Wow! Yeah, Mississauga, so just outside of Toronto area. Yeah. A little bit bigger than...

Host (00:19)
My

parents went Regina Mississauga Kelowna so natural progression.

Casey (00:23)
natural.

similar to your story, I did my teacher's college and then Ontario was like the epicenter for teachers. There's so many of us, so a lot.

congested with that profession there. So my husband and I decided to kind of see across Canada. His job is also quite congested. He's an optometrist. so it's really cool. I don't know if many people know this, but there's two optometry schools in Canada. One is English, one is French. So one's in Quebec and the other's in Ontario.

Host (00:53)
there's only one English optometry school in the entire country. Yeah.

Casey (00:56)
Wow. it's cool because it brings people from all over the country to Ontario. Yeah. my husband has a lot of epic friends that live across the country that we got to bounce around and kind of check out the different areas. And some good friends of ours live here and they showed us that the water was quite nice here.

Host (01:13)
⁓ That it is.

Casey (01:14)
Yeah, so we ended up kind of signing on to life here for two years. I got a teaching job and he got a job doing optometry we kind of said after two years figure out if this is the place for us or if we want to go back home because all of our family's back East and it's really important to us we didn't have kids yet and I really thought that we'd end up back in Ontario. Two years came and went and it was tough to leave the epicness of the Okanagan.

So we stayed. We continued teaching and we got married while we were out here and then just after that I had some health stuff go on that had me on a leave. And so on my leave a lot of time to think which is...

Host (01:59)
scary.

It's good and bad. ⁓

Casey (02:02)
And as you know from our conversation teaching requires a lot. It's not nine to five It's not eight to four it is I would say up to like three in the morning doing lesson plans. Yeah, like

You know, we give it our all. so it was a lot thinking about that and kind of thinking coming from a bigger city center what the Okanagan, especially Kelowna, was kind of missing back in 2015 time. And there was some room for growth, which we've obviously seen. I kind of had three different ideas. But the one idea that I really couldn't find was this all inclusive, allergen free bakery.

At that time we were having friends who were having babies and because of that they were having food restrictions. We know within our family we've got eggs, dairy, soy, a bunch of nuts. What else did I not say? Sesame, gluten, and garlic. Which doesn't apply here but also really difficult. Especially in a family that loves garlic.

Host (02:55)
assessment.

Casey (03:02)
I kind of saw that as a route to pursue here, because often we could find things that are gluten free but not nut free, or they'd be nut free but not vegan, and we took it on ourselves to kind of...

Host (03:12)
And did you have any business experience before this or anybody in your family to lean on or?

Casey (03:18)
Ironically, yes and no. our family kind of is speckled. Larger picture family is kind of speckled with entrepreneurs, if you will. And then ironically, I have two brothers and myself and both my brothers kind of went out on entrepreneurial ventures when I would...

Generally say in our training, that might not have been the route. one brother is a tree farmer in Nova Scotia right now with his partner and it's super cool. my other brother went on to work in kind of finance and financing on his own venture. Wow. So yes and no. Like we were all kind of doing it at the same time, which was cool. Compounded with having kids at the same time, which is crazy.

Host (03:58)
Yeah.

Casey (03:58)
You know.

Yeah. it's been it's been an interesting journey

Host (04:03)
so you're developing this idea while you were on leave and then when was the defining moment of did you have the name and the whole we're doing this did you create a business plan and all that or

Casey (04:16)
I had those three ideas and I created like a one page business plan, quote unquote, ⁓ as to what the ideas would look like. And again, the other two, was like, there's something along the lines that have been done like this before or are available, but there was nothing like Big Fat Lion. Big Fat Lion is the nickname that my dad gave himself and we knew him as Big Fat Lion growing up. And so there's this kind of

train of lion throughout our lives. We're the Cubs, my mom's the lioness. It's very weird, but very our family. it. Yeah. Yes, and so it's a nod to my dad. So the name came easy, the recipe's not so much.

Host (04:54)
Unique.

that's beautiful.

this kind of is with the name, but who designed your beautiful logo?

Casey (05:06)
So cool, right? Yeah. I went to a local place and I was like, I want to work with you. And they kindly rejected me.

Host (05:15)
They...

Casey (05:17)
It

was for my benefit. They were like, we would love to, but I think you should try this route instead. there's a really cool website called 99 design that they pointed me in the direction of and how it works is you kind of say, this is what I'm looking to get a logo, business cards, t-shirts, and you can say, this is what I'm going for. These are the colors I want. This is the name to kind of give them things to go off of. it's almost like a design contest. So you put that up there.

and designers can bid on it. they bid on it by saying, look, here's my concept that I got from what you said. you can talk to them a little bit and be like, I like this, I changed this. by the end of round one, you choose your top five. round two goes into narrowing that down, talking with them more, making changes. you get into the end of round two and you've chosen your person. you continue to work with that person until you've got it absolutely tweaked to where you want. absolutely.

would recommend because I love it.

Host (06:14)
Cool idea. I've never heard of that website. I've learned something. I'll have to check it out. That's cool.

Casey (06:19)
definitely recommend.

keep going back whenever I need something new to. ⁓

Host (06:22)
the same person. Now

you have that connection, that's so neat! Yeah okay now to go back to these incredible recipes, yes. Were you much of a baker beforehand?

Casey (06:27)
Super cool.

in the terms of rip open a Pillsbury package and put it in the oven. no. Yeah. Yeah. Rice Krispies were my go to. Yeah. Yeah.

Host (06:45)
did not know Rice Krispies have, well the brand name Rice Krispies are not gluten free. I couldn't believe it. it's rice and then you look at the ingredients it's not just rice. Maybe we'll go for the ones that are just rice. Right? Yeah it's wild. I digress what's your journey with these recipes?

Casey (06:50)
There's so much

So much more than that.

12.

I'm a bit of a person that I like to do things and then share it rather than say like, I'm gonna do this. this was kind of top secret that I was doing this, my family kind of knew.

what I did, my first goal was to get into the clone of farmers market, which is where we,

got our start, shout out to them. It's an epic spot as I'm sure you know. when we got into the farmers market, we were just at home bakery in our home kitchen. the only person really that knew was my husband. And he was my guinea pig, which a lot of people I've heard said, I would have loved that job. my husband has such good willpower and he doesn't love sweets so much as like a hundred percent dark chocolate. No, not my target audience.

Yeah. he was my test dummy. I'd be eating like seven of the same cupcake to make sure it was good. He would take a bite out of one. it took like over a year to get my core recipes down.

Host (07:55)
What was the progression of the first recipe you nailed and then where did it go from there?

Casey (08:00)
I think I went, it's actually funny because I try to think about these things and I think I've just blocked out that time. ⁓

I definitely know that we had our snickerdoodle cookie, our BFL cookie, and I think our Nanaimo and date square were our first couple. Okay. Yeah, kind of classics. Yeah. Yeah. Good ones. We've got chocolate, we've got sugar, cinnamon, you know. Are you a Nanaimo person?

Host (08:26)
Not really, but I've obviously tried yours and the date I think we just had the date a couple weeks ago actually but Your chocolate cookie is I don't even like cookies. ⁓ I've never really liked cookies and the girls got one to share and they They share give you a bite, right? I said, I might need another bite. yeah

Casey (08:48)
Alright

Host (08:48)
Yeah,

but I think they use black cocoa in it. It's a dark. Yes. It's got that different flavor. That's delicious. But yeah, really good. what were we talking about? We were talking about your recipes, the order they came in. Yeah. You started from your kitchen.

Casey (09:04)
Yeah. started in our kitchen, a top secret, got into, well, how the farmers market works is that you have a day of like trial. you apply, you get a confirmation, you can come get a date, and then you set up your market tent as if you have done this all your life. You set it up, market opens, people can buy from you and they come around and kind of check you out, make sure you'll be a good fit.

Host (09:15)
How does this work? Super cool.

Oh, there's actually a panel of people or? Oh, okay.

Casey (09:35)
Yeah, little

intimidating. I, the first day that we were doing it, was a little ahead of the carriage, if you will, and was like, I need to make 17 dozen cupcakes. Wrong move. So you do it and you're able to sell. And then after that, you kind of hear you got in or maybe make these tweaks and let's talk again. at the end of that market, I have my...

16 and a half dozen cupcakes still. I'm looking around and I'm like, I've made a grave mistake. Perishables was not the most.

So yeah, it was fun. We got into the market and the market is just, it's so fun. It's like a family. Everyone there is kind of in the same spot. People give you tips. People tell you maybe try this market. Everyone's looking to give each other a hand up, which is really nice. Such a sense of community and you really get a feel for the other vendors as well as your customers in the community in that sense too. you can just feel whether you're a vendor or a customer going to that market.

There's a pulse there.

Host (10:41)
that that's a great word yeah there definitely is a pulse yeah i hate to ask but if you get in does that mean somebody gets booted out

Casey (10:44)
That's really cool.

it's kind of cool in that sense too that as you kind of grow for instance how we kind of moved from our kitchen We rented a commercial kitchen started wholesaling and then we're lucky enough to open our storefront Once you get a storefront, they kindly ask you to no longer come to the market. in that sense, it's kind of like a startup

Because if I have my storefront and I still take a spot at the market, it's not creating that space to ebb and flow and for new creators to come in. Right. So they kindly ask you.

Host (11:18)
that's a really nice concept. you want people to move out because that means that they've become successful and they're on to the next stage of their their business. Yeah. Well, that's cool. Now in doing that stage, the risk to open up a storefront is a pretty big move.

Casey (11:36)
Yeah.

Host (11:37)
I'm wondering about that transition when you're realizing, okay we're big enough now that we need a storefront or a permanent place. in that transition what was it like trying to find a place in the city?

Casey (11:51)
So to backtrack to the start, going from my leave and teaching to this, kind of, I saw this need and I really wanted it and the health stuff kind of pushed it forward. this is the move that I want to do and I want to try it. my husband was like, I thought you were a teacher. Very kindly. I didn't know we were going to do this.

Host (12:12)
Very supportive.

Casey (12:16)
The man has worked many markets for me, so I will give him all the credit in the world. But it's a different move than teaching. A little less secure. Anywho, so I said to him, this is what I'd like to do, and I'd like to get a storefront on Bernard.

I don't know if you know the most expensive place to get a storefront, but I'd assume one of them would be...

Host (12:38)
Bernard on Bernard, especially in this day and age, maybe not, not maybe not back in the day, but now that the city has evolved it into the happening place, right? It's amazing down there. It's beautiful. Yeah, I imagine right now that's kind of the spot.

Casey (12:54)
Yeah. So in saying that to him, he was like, maybe let's try the farmer's market first. Fine.

Host (13:01)
You're

like, good point. Yeah. Okay.

Casey (13:06)
Let's do some testing of the market. Yeah. I calmed down a little bit, started at the farmers market and we were at the farmers market in 2019, which was incredible. it's cool because they've got Wednesdays and Saturdays. so we're rocking Wednesdays and Saturdays and it gets hot. And it gets...

Host (13:23)
Yeah, I was

about to say your stuff melting? how are you keeping your right?

Casey (13:29)
Yeah. it's a balance of having it cool enough, bringing coolers and having it out and displayed. it's definitely like a super fun dance that you do. Finding the right shady spot, you know? Pulling things out at certain times. Super fun. we did that and then.

Host (13:45)
Sorry

to interject, did you travel at all to other markets or was it your home base was Wednesday, Saturday?

Casey (13:50)
Home base was Wednesday, Saturday. The travel with what we do a little trickier than a t-shirt. we kind of stayed home base there. then COVID hit, which is great for everyone. then we also had our first child.

at the exact same time. that was really cool in that it pushed us more into wholesale. opened up some doors for us that way, which we've absolutely loved working obviously with all the coffee shops, cafes, grocery stores. It's just been really cool to, as you said, meet that connection and network of small businesses throughout the Okanagan. Super cool. that was lucky enough for us. And then moving obviously into wholesale brought us

into a commercial kitchen rental out of chickpeas. Have you been there?

Host (14:32)
No, I've heard of it though. Is that chickpeas?

Casey (14:37)
chickpeas. They are the owners are where they're in that landmark. Landmark area if you know like porters and copper brewing. Yep, they're just kind of two doors down.

Host (14:47)
Yeah.

wait, is this the place where I go to get my black lentils? Is this the wholesale seed? Like a mini bulk bar? Yes. ⁓ I there all the time. I've heard of it. It's called Cheeky. They're the only place to get beluga lentils in town. Yeah. my goodness. Like every third week. My goodness. OK, so you are selling your stuff in Cheeky's.

Casey (15:07)
Maybe once or twice heard of it.

were

and then we they've got a commercial rental kitchen in the back.

Host (15:19)
I see, did not know that, okay.

Casey (15:21)
Yeah, right? Super cool. They've been kind of the start of engine for a ⁓ couple different bakeries as well. from there, we kind of realized, okay, there's only so much we can grow in this space because it is an awesome space, but it's within another business.

Host (15:42)
So they

had make equipment already? Or did you have to purchase commercial?

Casey (15:45)
I bought some the

equipment. they've got fridge, freezer, two tables I think and like a shelving unit. Yeah. then I bought the commercial oven, bought the commercial mixer.

Host (15:55)
Because

that's a big deal.

Casey (15:58)
But a smaller deal than buying a whole store. it was nice to have those kind of stepping stones.

Host (16:01)
a tree.

Well, how

can you so buying a commercial mixer and what was the research that you that went into doing that? how did you know which one to get?

Casey (16:18)
have no idea. I...

Host (16:21)
I blocked it. Did you block it?

Casey (16:24)
I constantly, when people are how do you do this? I say all the time, I have no idea what I'm doing. You don't have a business the research that went into it, I think I, maybe an hour's worth of research and was like, let's, I don't. do it. Yeah. I would do the same amount of research for a TV.

Host (16:30)
You know?

You know what's really cool about this though is that I find that

It's about just, ⁓ that's such a Nike slogan, but it's about, it's about action. So much we get caught up in the research and the planning to the point where we're stymied and we can't move forward. I've experienced that with the equipment to buy for the podcast. You get so overwhelmed with all the choices. You're doing so much research, but then you can't make a decision. And there's actually something really

unique and awesome about just being at the end of the day, probably doesn't matter, choose something and move forward.

Casey (17:22)
Yeah. I feel like trained chefs and bakers would be cringing right now.

Host (17:29)
the other thing is the equipment we have today, 30 years ago, anybody would die for that, even if it's not the top of the line for 2020, whatever year you're in, it's like any type of sports equipment now too, Do you need this year's model? 10 years ago, they would have thought last year's model was epic too. Yeah. Okay, so you're in this kitchen, you're buying your stuff.

Casey (17:48)
It's good perspective.

we just got to a point where it was we need more hours in the kitchen that we may not be able to have. we were storing extra ingredients where our child was crawling around and it was just we're growing or, or are we just kind of staying here? If we stay here, probably end up closing down Big Fat Lion. Not sustainable. Yeah. Which was super cool.

Host (18:14)
not sustainable.

Did

you have help at this time or is it still just your husband?

Casey (18:19)
I had my husband was not I love him. He was not helping at this time. he was this is you Yeah, which was super cool and I had one employee at the time who was amazing and allowing me to also raise my son So it was awesome. But again, if we want to grow we needed more employees and a bigger team and ⁓ such a risk, but I also said

Host (18:38)
risk commitment.

Casey (18:41)
to Danny, my husband, at the time, in talking this out, because he's definitely more the risk averse one in the relationship. I'm let's do it and we'll figure it out. If I don't try a storefront, I'll always wonder. So. so.

Host (18:56)
Yeah, what could have been.

Casey (18:59)
We started looking and there was talk of partnering with a coffee shop to do it. there was talk of going out on our own. in the end, I kind of say I'm a people pleaser a little bit. I've got some spice. I think anyone who knows me would say that I'm a little spicy. I realized that if I partnered with someone, I would never fully do it my way.

Which is good and bad. But I like to appease people so I would often, I think,

Host (19:27)
a good realization to know that very teacher of you to self-reflect on that and understand that if you're partnering with somebody you're going to be acquiescing to things that you might not want to and then you're always gonna have that slight ⁓ this isn't exactly what I want it's your vision your idea you started it from the ground up yeah I get that

Casey (19:53)
And I've heard before, partners can be great, but finding the right one? like a marriage. Right? Yeah. So.

Host (19:57)
Yeah.

so you stayed in it yourself.

Casey (20:04)
solo and then looked around at a number of spots and it was quite difficult. It was interesting because I was looking in, I would say 2021, 2022 and 2022 is when we found our location.

Host (20:16)
What were some of the locations in the city that you contemplated?

Casey (20:21)
⁓ Where did we look? We looked down Enterprise. We looked down just off Bernard and St. Paul. We looked on Ellis in that Ella, live at Ella? At the bottom there. looked at a couple different places and just again never having built out a space never having a commercial space of our own figuring out.

Host (20:36)
Yeah, with high rise there.

Casey (20:48)
obviously finances for those different spaces and sizes. It was very interesting because I don't have background in any of that. kind of assuming what I needed for, if I wanted a storefront where people could come in or if I just wanted a bakery area where it was more wholesale.

We went through stages of finding places that was very exciting and then it was it's actually not the square footage we thought it was or this is very exciting, but there's some legal things going on that are going to have people coming through your space. it was very interesting working through it. And in a time where there was so much building in Kelowna, I found it crazy difficult to actually find a place.

period, a loan that suited us.

Host (21:31)
And it's something where you don't want to be moving around all the time because it's your home and you got all this massive equipment you don't want to be on it right to begin with.

Casey (21:39)
Totally. But it's also... Yes,

you want it right to begin with, but it's also intimidating because it's most leases I would assume are five or ten years. I have no idea how this is gonna go. Do you sign for five? Do sign for ten?

Host (21:53)
Yeah. And what if it grows even more? Right. What if you outgrow that space? Right. man. Yeah. So how many years have you been in the spot you're at?

Casey (21:59)
It's...

So we signed in 2022. We opened in the spring of 2023. And so, two years.

Host (22:10)
years. Coming

up two years. And that whole that whole little street right there is really coming alive. Mother ferments and brandy with Empire Crepes around the corner and it's ⁓ yeah that whole block is

Casey (22:17)
It's so cool.

It's really cool. And it's fun. There's there's people that we had never heard of and there's people that we grew up at the market with. So, neat. Yeah. It's really nice to see others kind of alive in that sense, too. And the continued growth of them.

Host (22:43)
we've lived here for so long and that block was just empty. It's just this empty barren land. And then they dug that big hole and it just sat there and we were wondering for a very, very long time, what are they going to build there? It could have been anything. And so whoever developed that, did the city is such a amazing,

service because it has the ability to have all these little shops front at the back and then behind it on the next street as opposed to a giant warehouse or whatever it could have been. could have been another apartment block too but

Casey (23:17)
Yes,

it's pretty cool how the city has free rent to provide. That area, because as you say, warehouses, right? Yeah. And you see so much of that kind of changing over, which is a cool utilization of the buildings.

Host (23:24)
Well this neighborhood absolutely it's regenerate. ⁓

Okay, so you're in your new place. What is that road called? V-A-U-G-H-N.

Casey (23:40)
Vaughn Vaughn Vaughn F Vaughn

I like to say on the other side of Clement in between Athel and Richter Perfect I still got nothing I'm like you know where rustic reel is?

Host (23:48)
Nice.

yeah right across right nice rustic yeah it's too bad the bc the market isn't there ⁓ i used to love getting my veggies from that market very good spot so you opened up your place and then did you then upgrade your equipment again

Casey (23:54)
Yeah.

Good spot. It was a beer.

⁓

So something that was super cool is there was we in our recipe testing phase we tried so many different gluten-free flours. It's a thing they're not all the same. I don't know if gluten flours are all the same because I wasn't into it as much back then and I don't work with gluten flour now.

Host (24:19)
Yes, this is a thing. No.

I feel

like wheat flour, can just go and buy flour and it is what it is. you have your pizza flour, your double O, which is super fine. you have your strong protein and you have your whole wheat flour.

Casey (24:43)
Yep.

Host (24:45)
But that's about it. If you get regular white flour, it doesn't matter what company you buy it from.

Casey (24:51)
⁓ Not all gluten-free flours are made the same. So we tried so many different ones and it's also interesting, I found that even if you have the same recipe in BC and you try and use it in Ontario, you're not going to get the same result. Even if you bring your flour, even if you bring all your ingredients. Obviously, ovens, all that jazz. But these were all things that I learned. just assumed just like flour, flour is flour. kitchen's a kitchen. No.

Host (25:09)
humidity, climate, pressure.

So how did you find? Yeah, tell me.

Casey (25:23)
So we tested a whole bunch and this one brand called Picnic was awesome. It was great. I'm probably not saying that right. I don't think I ever say anything right.

Host (25:34)
Welcome

to the club.

Casey (25:36)
And we loved it and it was cool because we founded at Choices and then we started ordering through Choices and then we started getting bigger and ordered through the company which was really cool. And then that company was an allergen free company out towards the coast. Our coast, yep. Canadian. And they reached out. ⁓

Host (25:53)
our coast.

Casey (25:59)
just before our weird, look, kind of in the phase where we were talking about opening up a storefront and they said, listen, we're closing up shop. And I was like, this is my flower. What am I gonna do? They're like, do you wanna buy our business?

what? I want to buy their business. What? And so obviously it was kind of a huge mulling point. Wow. Yeah.

And so we were lucky enough because you can't, as an allergen free company, we take our cross contamination very seriously. We don't buy equipment secondhand because if it had nuts on it one time, if it had gluten on it one time, regardless of how it's been cleaned, people may roll their eyes on that, but we just don't want to take it.

Host (26:45)
⁓

We are professional.

Casey (26:48)
I am. And so when this other Aladdin Free Company whose flower we loved was do you want to, this could be yours if this worked out, okay, this could be a thing. luckily enough through conversation, whatnot, we got to keep our flower, which is now our flower mix. Oh, that's Yeah.

Host (27:08)
Did you rebrand? you rebrand?

It doesn't matter how you're saying the name because now it's called Big Fat Lion. Flower? Flower. There you go.

Casey (27:15)
Exactly. All

purpose flour, we use it for everything that we make. the fact that it did not go out of business and we had to start from scratch.

Host (27:24)
⁓ So, you gotta tell me more about how this works.

Casey (27:28)
So it was super cool. We bought their tables and we got their mixers and we got two more ovens from them. in the whole process of everything, they shipped everything out. We stored it. We then got our space and with obviously a lot of help, helped build out our space the way we wanted it to be. And then.

And the time was right, we brought all the things in and set it all up. now we've got three mixers, three ovens, their tables, some of their shelving. it was really cool because kind of the legacy of them was continued and kept alive in a sense. And it was nice because we didn't have to see them completely closed down their chapter because you know how much blood, and tears. Having a baby of any kind.

Host (28:10)
tears. Yeah. He sort. Yeah.

Well, I'm learning. Yeah. I'm learning through these podcasts. Yeah. ⁓ Right.

Casey (28:19)
So yeah, it was cool. we obviously were able to get equipment that was more financially accessible to us. an opportunity like that, as I said, would not come up. Alleged and free bakeries are not throw a stone and you'll hit one. So an opportunity like that was pretty cool. And the timing just worked out. And that was another reason that kind of pushed us to do it at that time.

Host (28:43)
And how does gluten-free flour is a mixture of all these other components? when you bought their business, is it you've bought their recipe and then you make the flour? Is that what it is? And then they've told you where to source all the ingredients from? Or how does that work?

Casey (29:02)
them telling us and a little bit of us being like okay we got to figure this out on our own.

Host (29:06)
Okay. Yeah. But the big thing is the recipe and the proportions and all that. Okay. Yeah. Cool. Yeah.

Casey (29:11)
totally. So that was...

I'm like, we've tried so many flowers. Like the thought of that flower...

Host (29:21)
I'm about to open my pantry in the hall closet and look at all the gluten-free flour for my youngest daughter that we've just bought trying to figure out. my god. Yeah, it's quite... Thank you for existing is all I can say.

Casey (29:31)
Right?

Thanks for the support.

Host (29:40)
Yeah, I'm new, fairly new to the whole gluten-free thing. it's been around for a while, but unless it directly affects you, you don't really understand. you can't understand it. You can't understand it. And we do have a family member who's very, severe celiac. So I've seen it secondhand through the, life, but you're not living it.

or having to make the meals and all this stuff and now when you have a little one who can't have gluten you're thinking my goodness okay all of a sudden your whole life we used to go to coffee shops all the time and get coffee and the little ones would get a little treat well now all of a sudden sorry can't okay now we need to stop going to these places because it's hard for a six-year-old to understand and you can bring your own stuff

the walk but it's not the same and then when we found you well it was through Aaron at craft 42 you had your stuff up i'm like wait all of this is gluten free yeah ⁓ okay and then it and then not only is it gluten free but it tastes better than regular cookies ⁓ thanks for saying you're walking around and you realize that these little places through town carry your stuff so now we stop at places that carry your stuff so that Riley can you know not feel left out yeah

Casey (31:01)
I love it.

Host (31:03)
So thank you so much.

Casey (31:04)
We're nothing without you.

Host (31:06)
Well

yeah, so you know it all goes hand in hand. I just make you a list. Could you go here and here? Now do you have any dreams to expand further into other things like pizza dough?

Casey (31:18)
Pizza dough, yes. So we do. We get a lot of requests for breads and more savory things. And we do have goals and dreams of going there. We've got ideas, we've got kind of plans. What it is is the time and ability to do it. The business life is such a roller coaster, as I'm sure many of the other people you've talked with and experienced yourself and your husband.

And it's just okay, we're we're busy, busy, busy, busy, busy. why are we not busy right now? What's going on? And your brain starts playing with you. And in those times, we're like, okay, let's use this moment to kind of...

test and do new things and then as soon as you kind of get on a roll of testing you're like we're busy again and you've got to keep up with everything and so it's this catch-22 of we want to be busy all the time but we want to have time to also play and figure out new things so it's kind of that tug of yes and it's i think it's funny from an outside perspective and i would have been the same before having a business just make brett just do it

Host (32:14)
recipes and whatnot.

that's not that easy.

Casey (32:26)
It's not that easy. think anyone who has made bread, period, knows bread is a super fun thing to make in the way that it can go right or it can go wrong. Yeah. Where my sourdough people at. But then you take away eggs and you take away gluten and you take away dairy and then nuts, soy. Ingredients here. it takes a lot of testing to get one thing right, let alone others.

Host (32:29)
Yeah.

You

You're left with very few.

Casey (32:53)
And I'm a big cinnamon bun girl, so I really wanna do cinnamon buns too.

Host (32:58)
That'd be great.

Yeah. Yes.

Casey (33:02)
Yeah, so stay tuned. We do have plans for buns, breads, cinnamon buns,

Host (33:09)
The

other hard thing with bread too is people expect it fresh made that morning because there's so many in town bakeries that make it that morning. we were somewhere out by the airport because the girls are in golf and my eldest and I went down to get a coffee and a little pastry and it was buy one get one free are these two for one? they're yesterday's. I was yes I'm like so

Casey (33:17)
Yes.

Host (33:32)
They're one day old and automatically ⁓ they're trash. thought, geez, well, we'll just get them. We'll take those off your hands. to have that expectation of always needing fresh, but to start it off, I would imagine is quite tricky. I do feel there's a huge, well, that's again, like you don't really know.

Casey (33:46)
Yeah.

Host (33:52)
how big of a gluten-free pizza market is there in town? There's a huge pizza market, big enough that now all the stores carry fresh dough every day, and your fresh basil and your everything. But then how many people would support gluten-free pizza dough? Yeah.

Casey (34:07)
And then also the.

the

lifespan on anything gluten-free, dairy-free, we don't add any artificial preservatives to anything we do and those natural preservatives that come with gluten, eggs, dairy, et cetera, we just don't have that. you look at any gluten-free anything compared to quote unquote the typical. Yeah. And the lifespan is just automatically shorter. Yeah. Right. So you got to kind of figure all that out. it is when you go to a bakery, I think there is that expectation that you're getting bread fresh versus if

go to Nature's Fair where we buy our bread at the moment and gluten-freeze in the freezer, right?

Host (34:46)
Yeah,

it's amazing how good it tastes out of, even your baked goods. You freeze them, take them out, and they're just fine. Just fine, yeah.

Casey (34:54)
Yeah, it's super cool. We've

tried and tested everything and we've also thought about having like a little freezer grab and go section. ⁓ yeah. Yeah, it's just kind of working it all in.

Host (35:03)
Oh! That's a great idea!

Yeah, that's a really good idea. The other thing I was wondering you could have ⁓ for spring or summer when you get into pizza dough because you will you will but you could advertise it as a monthly thing this day. We're doing a big batch of gluten-free pizza dough And then it gives people time to We're going to do pizza night on this friday because we can go pick up our pizza dough that day Yeah, yeah. Thanks

Really, it's just a selfish way for me to get good gluten-free pizza dough. I like it. But do know what I mean? Yeah.

Casey (35:41)
Yeah, that

is cool. It's nice because there's still room to grow. I don't, I still consider us a small bakery. I actually had this conversation with my husband. when do you become a medium sized business?

Host (35:53)
⁓ actually the definition of a medium sized business in Canada is, is interesting because it's two different ways of thought. a small business is you have under a number of employees. I'm actually going Google this. it's your revenue per year. And it's bigger than what you think.

Casey (36:04)
Okay.

Host (36:11)
in Canada.

for most purposes a small business is one with between one and 99 employees. I will Right, There's variations depending on how much profit you bring it bring in and stuff like that but to me there needs to be another

Casey (36:19)
forever be small.

Host (36:33)
There is a distinct difference between a business that's one to five employees or one to 10, to 25 to 50 to a hundred. those are all, there should be another definition like micro.

Casey (36:48)
crew.

Yeah, I like that. That's our energy should go.

Host (36:50)
Nano.

Yeah. Because how many businesses have more than 100 employees? Right?

Casey (37:01)
small like well I was gonna say how many small businesses have more but that's redundant.

Host (37:06)
Yeah,

how many small businesses have more than 25 employees?

Casey (37:11)
Yeah, I mean, the Okanagan's bringing up some good stuff. It's cool to see different local spots opening up a second or third location to see that growth and in everything you look anywhere in the Okanagan. When did you move here?

Host (37:14)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Born and raised. I moved away. I did my walkabout. I moved away for university and went and lived abroad and realized, okay, Kelowna is stunningly beautiful. know both of our families were here. So we made a conscious decision to move back to Kelowna.

Casey (37:42)
It's probably very hard for you. It's ugly here. It's really quite easy. Yeah.

Host (37:44)
no.

Yeah.

When you don't, you know, when you have a beautiful family, we're very, very fortunate. Both my husband and I come from families that are just we love them. We like being with them. They're great. Everybody's a great person when we enjoy their company. when you have a loving and supportive family that you come from, why would you move away if you don't need to, you know? Although that being said, my mom

My mom came from a loving and supportive family and she left her family to come to Kelowna.

Casey (38:23)
Same.

Host (38:26)
Although some people their careers take them and they don't really.

Casey (38:29)
Yes.

Right. Yeah. I was going to say when you do tell your family that you're doing this, this should be the first podcast because what you just said that you should. The first episode rather. I love that. That's pretty sweet. Yeah. But yeah, it's we have room. We want to expand our product line. Yeah. I think the ultimate goal is to. I don't want world domination. don't. I don't want.

Host (38:39)
They're venom

Yeah.

on YouTube.

Casey (38:57)
I don't want even to be across Canada, I don't want that. BC, I don't know. the goal for Big Fat Line is when people come to Kelowna, I'm a person that likes to do a lot of research specifically around food when I go somewhere. And I want to be when people come to Kelowna, they do that research, they see us and they want to visit. That's where I want to

Host (39:16)
That's

all you know I wanted to ask you a question when you upsized

Casey (39:20)
Yep.

Host (39:22)
And you're doing it because you have your recipe and then you upsize and now you're making recipes at a larger scale. How was that? I guess not a one-to-one in your recipe to get bigger. Yeah. Was it? Yeah. I wasn't sure if it was like the ratios changed because now you're baking in such bigger quantities.

Casey (39:41)
most part we've been lucky and then it's just been kind of one-to-one it's been a slow progression because it's terrifying to like let's do 1700 pans and mess up that batch so it's definitely a slow progression but we've been lucky enough that it's been one-to-one the vanilla cupcakes gave me a run for my money for some reason when we doubled that it was like no but we've got it down now

Host (39:59)
interesting.

Yeah, yeah, and the nice thing because your stuff can be frozen is that your kid can take it to school and they can keep a little treat in the freezer and then when it's somebody's you know, it's always somebody's birthday and they all they have pizza and cupcakes or whatever it is. I never thought of this and now the teacher can go to the freezer and bring out a treat for your your kid so that they can still

be a part of the special moment for the birthday sort of thing. ⁓

Casey (40:31)
Yes.

This has been one of the best parts about the business. we obviously cater to all ages and anyone, food restriction, preference, lifestyle, regardless. But seeing the kids and when parents bring the kids in and they're just you can have anything. And they're what?

Host (40:51)
Yeah,

that's exactly what happened.

Casey (40:53)
It's

so cool and it's so heartwarming. we've seen it time and time again where parents that are bringing mini cupcakes to their kids class because they know everyone in that class can have that. We've got in our daycare kids obviously at the nut-free zone and we've got a kid who's anaphylactic to eggs and it's just

Host (40:56)
Yes.

Even cooked eggs?

wow. my goodness. What an allergy.

Casey (41:22)
as you said, if you're not in that realm, if that doesn't directly affect you, you just aren't aware.

Host (41:28)
You just don't get it. Yeah. How can you though? Right? It's like anything. You just don't know.

Casey (41:33)
But now being so aware and thinking of that one kid, that's not. That breaks my heart. It really does. Yeah. So it's really nice to kind of be able to fill that need in the market.

Host (41:38)
Yeah.

Yeah, you're really helping a lot of families

Feels good. It is a feel-good story.

I got- since I was lost in Daydream, they're thinking of lifting Riley up to see everything.

Casey (41:58)
⁓

I know we need like a little step stool for the kids.

Host (42:03)
⁓ yeah, yeah is pretty high. It is a little bit high. But they don't care, you know? As long as their parents' able-bodied to lift them up. They'll find a way.

Casey (42:12)
They'll find a way.

Where there are treats, they'll find a way.

Host (42:17)
Not just any treats, delicious treats.

Casey (42:18)
My kid, every time he goes in there, goes, I'm hungry. Just finished a meal, steps inside. So, I'm starving. Couldn't go another step. I show him pictures of what I did today. He's like, yum. Next picture, yum. My son's four and my daughter's two. Yeah.

Host (42:33)
How old is he right now? He's a... my goodness.

I can just hear their little voice. yum. yum. ⁓ yum.

Casey (42:42)
So cute. It's pretty fun. And it's cool to show your kids that you're doing something like this too, right?

Host (42:44)
That's pretty spotty.

Well, this is nice because we can record while they're at school.

they like to sit down there and listen to the podcast and when we go to the little restaurants they know the background this is neat to grow up with.

It would just be so cool to have a resource where, where's the place we want to go? Let's hear their background from their voice.

Casey (43:10)
Yeah,

totally. It's kind of funny to think that like this hasn't been done before. Like you've found something here.

Host (43:19)
yeah it kind of has because i know you can find like castanets a good resource for looking up restaurants there's always a little blurb and colonna now i i think always does a little write-up for new businesses i think infotel as well does stuff but it's kind of the same thing in that somebody is writing for you

Right? They're writing and it's nice. It's got the background and the little story and then they're short reads, but it's not directly from the person, which is different. Yeah. I personally love just conversational stories and we'll go off in a tangent and come back and it's easy listening. you can listen to it on a walk or on the car. Right. Whatever. Right. If you want to listen. Yeah.

And I just think it's a cute little niche. the whole point of it is to be easy listening. there's not gonna be any advertisements at the beginning and then in the middle and at the end. There's nothing, there's nothing. There's no political agenda. It's literally, let's know more about our neighbors and our community. if we know your story, we feel more connected to you. And then maybe we're going to shop and visit

more in our city, which Kelowna's doing a really good job of. And even in the first few short weeks I'm really learning that underground network of businesses. It's not really cutthroat at all. No. The businesses are all supporting each other and you'll all want each other to rise and do well and totally. How cool is that? It's super cool. Because I do feel that in some aspects Kelowna has a bit of a reputation for being clicky.

Casey (44:49)
super.

Host (44:58)
You hear that. hear that. I don't feel that, but you hear that. And when you hear these stories of how everybody's supporting each other, you're like, well, where's the clickiness? Actually, the people who are the people who are making this city what it is are the business owners, You're the ones that give vibrancy and life to the streets and places to go. And all of you so far have just been loving, caring, supporting each other. So.

nice to hear. You know like let's let's shine a light on that as much.

Casey (45:30)
room, There's so much room for everyone and what everyone's doing is needed in this community.

Host (45:35)
Yeah,

and I really like all the I love I just I just love listening to people too Like I love listening to people who are very different as well Yeah, like finding commonality is really fun But then listening to somebody who thinks in a way that I would never think but I think that's that teacher background Where you love the variety? Yeah, you love somebody saying something that you would never have thought of or seen something in a perspective that you're like, ⁓ I love those moments. Yeah

Casey (45:52)
Yeah.

So what did you teach?

Host (46:05)
Well, I ended up in elementary school. I started in senior, what was my practicum? My practicum was physics, chemistry, science. Oh wow. In China, it was a BC offshore school in Suzhou, which is this tiny city of like 8 million people. No one's heard of it. Let me catch up. No one's heard of it.

Casey (46:28)
⁓

Host (46:28)
And I think it was eight million at the time, but they thought it was actually closer to 12 just because of all the undocumented or I don't undocumented it's not the right word, but not everybody I don't know how they do the population there at the time. the principal who was at that school was moving to Vietnam to open a new school and he asked if I would because there was a couple of us asked if we would go and most of the teachers at the school are actually from Kelowna.

Casey (46:55)
3

Host (46:56)
Yeah, and so I've run into them all the time. It was it was one of the coolest years of my life the recruiter was from Kelowna And so he've recruited from UBCO the teacher Practical then your little networks all from Kelowna and so the word spreads. Hey, there's a BC offshore school. You have to be a BC certified teacher

Okay to teach there. anyways this principal was Moving to vietnam to open up a new school, but it was elementary I ended up teaching grade three at an american international academy I was so intimidated going from high school To these little tiny kids

they were so small. However, when we came back to Kelowna, this was in the day and age where it felt like winning the lottery to get on the TOC list. You remember that? there were no teaching jobs. People were working years as waitresses or whatever waiting to get on the TOC list. So I got back and because I was able to TOC grade one to 12,

Casey (47:40)
print.

Right.

Host (48:04)
They

said, ⁓ you're valuable. because of that, I got onto the TOC list. TOC'd for a year. That's the substitute list. They call it T. It's actually the TTOC, teachers teaching on call, as opposed to regular people teaching on call. my first job ended up being at Rose Valley Elementary in a five, six split.

the next year was then at Rose Valley. you're in that intermediate niche. And then it ended up just being the rest of my career was intermediate, And then teaching the young, young ones for so long, I got intimidated by the high school kids because they're taller than me. So, you know, I was like, Oh my goodness, this is funny. You just get, you can get normalized to your, to your age group. What did you teach? What subject?

Casey (48:50)
High school, yeah.

⁓

I was socials. Okay. And then I added on law and social justice, which was really cool. Yeah. Super cool. ⁓ but yeah, the, feel like there's a perception of like older students versus younger students. I feel as you say, you are made to kind of teach younger or you're made to kind of teach older. you find your niche and I am not made to teach younger. I love the nuggets. I like to call them nuggets. I love them so much, but I,

I remember I TTOC'd for five minutes. They're we're just gonna take a quick meeting. You just go through the alphabet with them, wash their hands and have snack. I was like, got it. Getting through that alphabet was like World War III. It was A, yes, my sister has a bunny.

Host (49:39)
This is kindergarten. And they all want to tell you everything.

Casey (49:41)
It was kindergarten. All

of B7 other hands go up. I was just like, ⁓ we're not making it to snack here, are we? So yeah, I enjoyed it. It was good, but it's a lot.

Host (49:53)
Yeah, what I found was it also feels like a performance holiday because they feed off of your energy. So you have to be, and you should be, you should be excited to see them. And I, genuinely are usually really excited to see them because you want the day to start off well. And you've spent all this time planning the day and you're so excited. Not that it ever goes as planned, but

I have a resting B face. my dad, my father had it too. Where our face, our face naturally, our face naturally, if I'm not consciously smiling, the face naturally looks like I'm kind of grumpy, but I'm not. It's just my face. Like I'm not, I'm not unhappy. I'm just not smiling. So at school you have to be smiling consciously smiling all day because they

Casey (50:33)
Yeah.

Host (50:45)
read your face and then your body language. And you know what it's like, you're like a counselor the entire day. You get to the end of the day, they leave, you're up, you're just utterly, you're tired. But now the real works begun. ⁓ Because now the actual job of marking and planning and prepping and parents and individualized learning plans for half of your class these days begins. But you got to go get your girls and now you're a mom.

Casey (50:58)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Host (51:14)
and I need a lot of sleep. I go to bed, unless it's game night, I go to bed between eight and nine. Yeah. And I can't, I just, and if I don't get sleep, I'm so grumpy. So I can't, this is not healthy. It's not healthy for, and I was actually, actually I was prioritizing the kids at school over my own kids. Cause I have to be on it for the school. And then I'd come home and just, this isn't fair.

Casey (51:19)
I love sleep.

grumpy.

Host (51:40)
They haven't done anything. Yeah. Yeah. But we were also in a position where I could step away from it, you know, but I still pay my teacher fee every year. Same. Just in case. Because if anything happens, I can always try and go back and teach. Yeah. Yeah.

Casey (51:43)
Good for you for realizing that.

It's

wild. Wild, wild west out there.

Host (52:01)
Yeah.

What do you think about the amount of education we needed to become teachers?

Casey (52:08)
Well, right after I graduated, changed, I think it's different in Ontario and BC. So right after I graduated, they changed it to a two year program. That was one year. You first? Yes, I did consecutive, not concurrent. So in Ontario, there's, can do it concurrently, which is five years. But you're doing, practicing all the way through. Versus consecutive, you do your undergrad and then you do a year just full on teachers.

Host (52:18)
Puppet, did you have to have a degree?

Okay.

Casey (52:36)
so I did that route and then we got three practicums, which is super cool because I got to experience private public and then ⁓

Host (52:43)
⁓

that is cool. Where'd you teach international?

Casey (52:48)
it was just a placement. it was two weeks, I think it was in St. Martin. it was awful. The worst. But it was interesting. It gave me such perspective because it was on an island. life was just very different and there was a lot of affluence there. I found it very laid back and chill. But also if you wanted to...

like technology was kind of, internet was not always reliable there to do certain things that you wanted and it was such a private, public, international, they were all such a different experience. It was super cool to see all the benefits and drawbacks that any situation has. And kind of figure out where I wanted to go.

Host (53:27)
Yeah.

It was interesting because education is a provincial matter. So each province had their own teacher certificate. And I think they've changed it. But back in the day, you couldn't be a teacher in Ontario and then come to BC. You had to go get more education to meet the requirements. You could have been a teacher for 10 years in Ontario, move out to BC, and now you're not a teacher.

Casey (53:54)
Yeah.

Host (53:55)
I'm actually a better teacher because I have 10 years experience, right? And I always thought that was ridiculous, but I think they've unified for the fact that you can go across the country. I do, and I understand the concept, especially pre-technology of if you're teaching, you should be an expert in the subject you're teaching. if you're teaching math, you should have university math, you should understand where math could lead you to, yadda yadda yadda.

Casey (54:02)
part.

Host (54:23)
But now I really question this because anything you want to do, anything you want to do, you can learn yourself. Can YouTube anything? You can learn absolutely anything independently on your own. So really what we need to do is we need to understand how to work and how to take action, like how to have an, not just have an idea, but how to have an idea and actually

Casey (54:32)
Yes.

Host (54:53)
make it it happen yeah and it doesn't matter what you're gonna do in life this is my dad saying he would always say it doesn't matter what you choose because i remember in grade 12 being so caught up in all the options of what to do in life you had to pick your job and careers i don't know what i want to be for the rest of your life and my father sat me down and he just said

it doesn't matter what you are. Choose something, choose anything and be the best you can at that. And if you're in the top 10 % of whatever profession you choose, you will do just fine. learn how to work. That's all you need to do. If you know how to work and you're responsible, you show up at time and you're constantly moving forward and bettering yourself, it doesn't matter.

Casey (55:37)
Thanks

that was one of my concepts of teaching that I tried to get across my students. I saw it as kind of boxes and boxes and the smallest box, because I taught history, socials, was the year that World War I happened. Smallest box. That's what I want you to learn. Bigger box. The concept of what happened in World War I and why it happened and what happened after that. even bigger than that, I wanted people to learn

the main picture. How to...

be organized, time management, how to work with people, how to talk to people, how to navigate situations where you may not want to work with your peer, but you have to anyways. You made a mistake, how to fix that and come back from it. Those were the big concepts that I felt in school were the most important that you take away. I was listening to the radio the other day and they were talking about kind of this exact subject where it's like, do we need post-sign

education anymore because the majority of us don't go on to do what we studied there.

Host (56:40)
wonder this too.

Yeah. And, the price of it.

Casey (56:46)
The price of it. However, at the same time, moving on to post-secondary is teaching you so much more. Maybe, I don't know, don't quote me on this. Don't cancel all secondary education, or me. ⁓ But it's, the concepts that you're learning, you can go on to learn yourself. You can research, you can be self-educated. However, that's still teaching you things because in high school, there's still a lot of handholding.

Host (56:58)
post.

Casey (57:16)
when you get to university.

Host (57:17)
Well

now there's still now there's handholding at university too. But you know what I mean.

Casey (57:24)
It

is that next step that that gives you more life skills and we're missing a lot of those life

Host (57:31)
We are. does it counterbalance the price of it? Right. I think the biggest thing I learned in university wasn't my courses. It was the fact that I moved away. So I became an adult. Like I knew how to live on my own, get my internet hooked up, pay the utilities, learned how to meal plan and buy your own. Like you learned how to be an adult if you moved away from university. You don't quite get that when you stay home.

But in this day and age, kids can't afford to rent somewhere anymore. You know, John and Lori were on the podcast and John bought his house as a waiter at the keg. He was able to save up enough money to buy down payment for his house as a waiter at the keg.

Casey (58:15)
The keg? My cousin is a waitress at the keg and she was working in Vancouver and then went to Whistler. She's like, I work one day in Whistler, make the same amount that I made in Vancouver in like a week.

Host (58:29)
I know. my point was that kids, no, no, no, that kids now can't afford to live on their own. Yes.

Casey (58:37)
might not be a popular opinion. No, it's okay. It was also expensive when we did it.

Host (58:41)
Do you think to the same degree though? Although I did live in a house with four people.

Casey (58:43)
everything.

Yeah,

same.

Host (58:46)
And two of them shared a room just because it was only a three bedroom house. Or it wasn't even a house, it was just the top floor of this little tiny house. And they shared a room. you did what you had to do. And you worked. Yeah. Worked a lot in my 20s.

Casey (58:57)
And you work.

Yeah.

I bet you worked weekends.

Host (59:03)
I liked working. I do like working.

Casey (59:05)
I did.

I remember the past tense.

Host (59:10)
Past tense. we definitely were debt averse. we worked so hard and as all of our friends were drinking beers on the weekend traveling and going on vacation, both my husband and I were aligned in our values that we put everything we had to pay our debt off as soon as possible.

Casey (59:26)
still

see the Instagram feeds, right? Of friends going on vacations every two months and I'm just that whole reel of work for yourself, they said, it'll be fun, said. Why work 40 hours a week for someone else when you can work 100 for yourself? It rings true.

Host (59:41)
Yeah, you're in the grind. How many hours a week do you think you work?

Casey (59:46)
I've lost count. I try not to think about that. I mean, it's fun and in that sense there's that roller coaster where it's I'm working so much. it's day and then run home and pick up the kids, make a dinner, and sometimes I'm just high five to the husband and run out the door. You serve them dinner, you put them down, I'm back to the bake shop and...

Host (1:00:07)
Yeah,

can't think of it as work. It's just lifestyle. It's a lifestyle. It's just lifestyle. Have you heard, I've started this new thing called after school dinner. Have you heard about this? This is me. Yeah. The girls, they, you know, they get home from school and my goodness, if they haven't eaten in two hours, they're starving. you feed them after school snack they're like not hungry for dinner.

then they need something before bed because they are famished, Absolutely not. But so that is, I came across this thing. And my husband works by the time he gets home. It's too late. if we wait for dinner he'll get home 630, my youngest goes to bed at 637. So this isn't.

Casey (1:00:33)
Again, it's been hours.

Host (1:00:51)
Ideal but it's only a few nights. He works really late. they come home and we'll have dinner after school And then they can just have their little before bedtime snack and we're done and they actually eat it because they're hungry right? It's after school as opposed to this like snack Dinner, you're not really eating and then before bedtime snack. Yeah, I thought this is genius. It's actually worked out pretty well

Casey (1:01:03)
Right.

Yes. Now can you be at my house to make that in time for me to pick my kids up?

Host (1:01:19)
Where do you live? ⁓ Well, when you get that gluten free pizza dough already. I'll there. I'll be there.

Casey (1:01:25)
See?

Yeah, time is such a... There's not enough time in a day. I don't know if there's ever been enough time in a day.

Host (1:01:33)
Yeah, my youngest, she's six. Isn't it interesting that a six-year-old brain understands and questions time? why is time slow and fast? How does time change? You she's asking me these questions. It's like actually time's a constant, I think, you know? And it's our perception of time. It reminds me of that Star Trek episode with Data and the

Kettle. Did you ever watch Star Trek? Anyways, I thought, what an interesting thing for a young mind to think and be wondering about and staying up at night, not being able to fall asleep because she's thinking about time as she almost thinks this time is like a living entity. I'm like, no, it's just, how do you explain time to a kid? You can, I'm like, we see time. We, we observe time.

Casey (1:02:12)
Mm-hmm.

I say you're having some cool

Host (1:02:23)
We see the effect of time because the sun in the sky and we see the effect of time through the seasons and grass growing. But like, she's like, but can you feel time? I'm like, oh, I don't know. Are you, are we feeling time right now? These are big questions. Yeah, I should, we should ask AI chat GPT, explain time to a six year old.

Casey (1:02:40)
questions. Go ask Siri.

I had a friend that was you ever, my son just kept asking questions that I didn't know the answers to. So we go out of Google Home, now we have a third parent that they can ask questions to. That has a majority more of the answers.

Host (1:03:00)
that's a great idea. Right? Yeah.

Yeah. And well, the answer is that we would have for them when we Google it, right? Actually, that's kind of cute. I like that.

Casey (1:03:10)
to the source.

Host (1:03:13)
the times have changed.

Casey (1:03:14)
pretty crazy. ⁓

Host (1:03:17)
I know it's

gonna be in 10 years, even 10 years from now. Oh, the city downtown is gonna be so...

Yeah. Well, should we call it a wrap? Let's do it. Thanks. thank you. Yeah, that was fun

Casey (1:03:24)
Let's